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8/8/2017 3:57 PM
 
I want to seek your advice on something. After 9 years of faithful service, it looks like my Nissan pickup may (probably is) be on its last legs.
First question, I doubt the Nissan will be drivable. Therefore, It is probably only worth parts value. It is a 2007 Nissan Frontier Crew Cab. Any ideas/suggestions on how I might dispose of it where I might be able to salvage some value?

Second question, assuming that my truck is beyond repair, any recommendations about a replacement? Here is what I need the truck to do:
1. Daily driver;
2. Carry 2 to 4 adults occasionally but mostly two;
3. Be off road capable (ie 4X4);
4. Be reliable, low maintenance as much as possible;
5. Serve as a highway rig (for potential family trips and teaching jobs; venue is Idaho, Montana and the northwest generally)
6. Have decent gasoline mileage (should I consider a diesel?)

As part of question two, here are some wants:
1. Have decent hauling capacity/towing capacity;
2. Have decent amenities (Air conditioning/power steering etc.)
3. Not be huge (I still want to travel Forest service roads in the wilds of north Idaho and western Montana).
4. Have skid plates;
5. Follow the grayman principle ie. hide in plain sight. I'd rather not call too much attention to myself.

I am leaning toward a midsize pickup possibly a Toyota Tacoma, but I am open to other ideas. I looked at an earlier thread but it appeared to have as many recommendations as posters.

Thanks in advance for your help with all of this.

 
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8/8/2017 4:30 PM
 

Ram Power Wagon.  Every single thing you could want for an outstanding all-rounder.  Comfortable, powerful, versatile, and completely off-road capable straight off the sales lot.  I will drive mine until the wheels fall off.  Love it.


Hill People Gear Coureurs des Bois (Brand Ambassador). Victoria faveat paratam. De Oppresso Liber.
 
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8/8/2017 5:00 PM
 
Really you need to narrow it down a lot more, because you have thrown too wide a loop. Additional questions that you need to be asking yourself, and letting us know otherwise answers are going to be all over the map.

1. New or Used?
2. Fullsize or midsize?
3. More cargo space or more people space?
4. Truck or SUV?
5. What kind of Forest Service roads, do you mean main feeder roads or are you going to get off on the little narrow side roads were a fullsize truck/SUV may not fit at all without dropping trees?
6. How much gear are you going to leave on the rig, i.e. are you going to mount a few thousand extra pounds of "overlanding" style gear, or are you going to keep it streamlined and light?
7. How big of a priority is gas mileage, i.e. is more time going to be spent commuting or on dirt?
8. What were your favorite things about the Frontier and biggest dislikes?

Depending on those answers, I might agree with Ken in other cases I would not. At this point, you are really just asking what is your favorite rig/what do you drive, which is fine, but in that case you should be asking folks for the what and why.

I drove compact trucks then mid-sized trucks until they stopped being so mid-sized (earlier 2000s Tacomas, Dakota, both gen 1 and 2 Tundras), and then went to a Jeep Unlimited because I didn't like the way the Tacoma sat, and I couldn't be happier. For where I live and what I like to do it is phenomenal. There is the reason it is basically the unofficial vehicle of Moab. On the other hand a highway machine it is not. If I was doing a lot of traveling by vehicle for long distances my choices might change. However, I have a hard time seeing going back to a full size truck for an all around vehicle.

Just based on what you wrote if you like the way the Tacoma sits, and the size of your Frontier worked for you then get one and drive on, or look at the 4Runner if you want an SUV.

Co-Owner Hill People Gear "If anything goes wrong it will be a fight to the end, if your training is good enough, survival is there; if not nature claims its foreit." - Dougal Haston
 
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8/8/2017 7:04 PM
 

I looked at the things he wants to do with the rig...and the Power Wagon hits pretty much all of those bases very nicely.  SUVs do have some limitations in the hauling side.  There was just a pretty good article on Expedition Portal recently citing the benefits of an off-road pickup.

However, I do love Jeeps, FJ -series 'Yotas (especially the classic FJ-60 "Iron Pig", and Defenders.  All viable options...but no matter what you choose, there will always be a trade off somewhere.  If they ever brought back the Kaiser Jeep M-715 in a modern version (with a few creature comforts) with a crew cab....I would actually think about trading in the PW.  


Hill People Gear Coureurs des Bois (Brand Ambassador). Victoria faveat paratam. De Oppresso Liber.
 
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8/8/2017 8:46 PM
 
I like the Tacoma. I'm on my second one (2013, TRD Sport, 4 door, 6' bed). I had an almost identical 2007 (non TRD) that was totaled due to a rear end hit in 2013. I live in central Virginia so my terrain is different, but the truck does check off a lot of your boxes. Carries 2 adults just fine, 4 when needed no problem. Reliable. As a highway rig it is just fine, we do a lot of driving to paddle whitewater and bike. 350-500 mile trips no problem. Off road capable with stock suspension for most folks if you know how to drive and aren't rock crawling. Put decent tires on it and it handles our central Virginia skidder path mud just fine. Amazingly nimble enough in the 4 door configuration to drive down our narrow, muddy skidder paths with no big worries. Plenty of aftermarket armor options.
Gray man, around here in silver it's a common enough vehicle.

I do have a 4wd 2004 Nissan Frontier crew cab with the 6' bed. This little truck is a beast. I hunt out of it most of the season and it's like a 4 wheeler that's street legal. I also have a 1993 YJ with the inline 6 and a front locker I cannot seem to make myself get rid of.

 
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8/8/2017 9:49 PM
 
Yup, more specifics will do a lot to filter out the responses. Size, budget and concrete MPG requirements will go a long way. Hyper specific pet peeves go even further.

I've liked the look of the new diesel dodge 1500 and the chevy colorado diesel because MPG is very high on my list, but as my dad is found of pointing out a $5000 rig that gets 10MPG is a lot cheaper to drive then a $50,000 that gets 30MPG. Last time I crunched the numbers on the 1500 in particular the break even point for the diesel upcharge was practically a decade out.
As Scot mentioned mid sized is hard to find anymore, I think I read that the Colorado is 90% the same dimensions as the Silverado, and the World Ranger that may or may not be available soon likely has a similar relationship with the F150.

I like diesel for reasons of multifuel options and safer fuel storage, but the former is practically moot with newer diesels and the later isn't a concern for most people. If you are shopping new the latest crop of gasoline vehicles are creeping close enough to diesel economy that you have to be putting a lot of miles down for them to make sense.
 
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8/9/2017 1:24 PM
 

Reliability means a Toyota. The gotcha is that you have to buy them new, because they hold value so well that it almost never pencils out to buy used (unless you're talking *really* used in which case it's a roll of the dice). Sadly, the Ram brand ranks dead last out of all 29 brands on the Consumer Reports reliability survey. Jeep brand doesn't rank particularly well either (although it is drug down by the Renegade). But you can get pretty good deals used on both. http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2016/10/ram-ranks-last-in-consumer-reports-reliability-survey.html

SUVs give the option of people or gear (fold down 3rd row), trucks tend to be better for hauling gear... but budget in a topper.

Like Fowler, I don't think diesels pencil out very well. And gas engines are getting pretty damned good. Our company hauler is an extra long 2014 Ford Expedition. It gets nearly 20mpg on the highway and has a cruise range of 450 miles. I LOVE the big gas tanks Ford puts in its rigs. Side note on Fords, I find them (the expedition, F150s) to be the "smallest driving" of the 1/2 ton pickup trucks. Suprising how maneuverable they feel for such big rigs. Once you get up to the 3/4 and 1 ton rigs, I don't know. The Expedition ranks high as a model for reliability. But its sibling the F150 is slipping in reliability.

The "off road" thing is a balancing act when it comes to size. Bigger vehicles are more comfortable on the highway, smaller vehicles go more places off road. Even the difference between Scot's fairly small JK and my 6" narrower with a shorter wheelbase XJ can be noticeable at times. Random, but I was just having a conversation last week with a guy who off-roads his Tacoma (lifted with 33s) a fair amount. He said he was tired of people telling him he was "in the trees" -- he's always into the brush on both sides of the roads around here. And he high centers more than most with the long-ish wheelbase. On the other hand, the tacoma is easily twice as comfortable on the highway as the JKs most folks around here drive. The longer and wider wheelbase is an asset on road. Plus the cabin is a lot quieter.

Realistically, for a backcountry adventure, small SUVs like the JK (and really everything Jeep makes) are 2 adults plus gear. If you want 3-4 adults plus gear, a Tacoma would be the minimum and really you need to go full size like the Ram.


We are fortunate in this matter that your conduct will be your marker and, thus, your reputation. The conduct of others on this forum has been, and will continue to be, their marker, and thus, their reputation. In the west, a person invests in one's reputation carefully. - 112Papa
 
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8/9/2017 2:11 PM
 
evanhill wrote:

Reliability means a Toyota. The gotcha is that you have to buy them new, because they hold value so well that it almost never pencils out to buy used (unless you're talking *really* used in which case it's a roll of the dice). Sadly, the Ram brand ranks dead last out of all 29 brands on the Consumer Reports reliability survey. Jeep brand doesn't rank particularly well either (although it is drug down by the Renegade). But you can get pretty good deals used on both. http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2016/10/ram-ranks-last-in-consumer-reports-reliability-survey.html

SUVs give the option of people or gear (fold down 3rd row), trucks tend to be better for hauling gear... but budget in a topper.

Like Fowler, I don't think diesels pencil out very well. And gas engines are getting pretty damned good. Our company hauler is an extra long 2014 Ford Expedition. It gets nearly 20mpg on the highway and has a cruise range of 450 miles. I LOVE the big gas tanks Ford puts in its rigs. Side note on Fords, I find them (the expedition, F150s) to be the "smallest driving" of the 1/2 ton pickup trucks. Suprising how maneuverable they feel for such big rigs. Once you get up to the 3/4 and 1 ton rigs, I don't know. The Expedition ranks high as a model for reliability. But its sibling the F150 is slipping in reliability.

The "off road" thing is a balancing act when it comes to size. Bigger vehicles are more comfortable on the highway, smaller vehicles go more places off road. Even the difference between Scot's fairly small JK and my 6" narrower with a shorter wheelbase XJ can be noticeable at times. Random, but I was just having a conversation last week with a guy who off-roads his Tacoma (lifted with 33s) a fair amount. He said he was tired of people telling him he was "in the trees" -- he's always into the brush on both sides of the roads around here. And he high centers more than most with the long-ish wheelbase. On the other hand, the tacoma is easily twice as comfortable on the highway as the JKs most folks around here drive. The longer and wider wheelbase is an asset on road. Plus the cabin is a lot quieter.

Realistically, for a backcountry adventure, small SUVs like the JK (and really everything Jeep makes) are 2 adults plus gear. If you want 3-4 adults plus gear, a Tacoma would be the minimum and really you need to go full size like the Ram.

 

Dang, Evan....you just got my blood up a little.  I have seen Toyotas crap the bed in a spectacular fashion overseas...and these were both ones built to be gun trucks (the infamous HiLux) and G-rides maintained by an embassy.  To the point of the transmission failing (no downshift) during a descent in the Peruvian Andes from ~16K down to ~ 7K.  It just decided to go out right then.  I have also had 'Yotas fail on me in Africa and Afghanistan....brake master cylinders, fuel systems, gauges, differentials, etc.  Don't believe everything written by publications.  Are magazines impervious to misrepresentation?  Doubtful.  Now, to actually be fair, many of the Toyotas I've rolled in have done quite well....but the brand is not without its faults.  The same hold true with just about any rig.  To summarily decide that Toyota is the only "reliable" option is just not so.  Sure....there are unreliable vehicles of every brand....but to just quote a magazine and decide it is gospel is not actually fair.

In the years I have owned my Ram Power Wagon, it has had precious little go wrong....in fact it has been VERY reliable.  Standard wear and tear is just that....standard.  I couldn't care less what Consumer Reports says....they are not the omnipotent source that they think they are, in my book.  Before I had my Power Wagon, I had a Quad Cab 4x4 Dodge Dakota.  That truck did everything I ever asked it to do.  I did several long distance trips from Virginia to Montana, Idaho, and Washington in it...and back.  Hauled a whole bunch of gear to camp and work on my land in the Flathead Valley, in bad weather, across the entire USA.  I only got rid of it because I had an opportunity to get the Power Wagon...and also donated an off-road built '79 CJ-7 at the same time to the Special Operations Warrior Foundation.  During my train-up out in the Mojave for Iraq / Afghanistan / Somalia, we could not get HiLux trucks to run our drills with at the time, because they weren't even available in the US.  So instead we rented a bunch of Dodge Dakotas and temporarily kitted them out as gun trucks.  We beat the snot out of those Dakotas.  We drove them at high speeds under NVGs on rutted desert roads, went off trail many times through very rough terrain, vehicle assault drills, and did roll-on / roll-off drills onto aircraft with them.  Through sagebrush, cholla cactus, rocks, sand, deep ruts, etc.  Those Dodges never failed us once.  Later on, when I decided to get a pick-up and stop using my off-road Jeep as a daily driver....I chose the Dakota because it had performed so well during the train-up for my mission.  We got big charges and nasty-grams from the rental car company....but every one of those trucks still ran great....they just didn't look so good cosmetically.  I bet my Power Wagon will still be running like a top long after your Land Cruiser has bit the dust...and I can take it places that yours won't go, too.  I learned to drive on a '58 CJ-3B Willys and have owned nothing but Jeeps and Dodges / Rams my entire life....simple upkeep and taking care of the vehicle go a long way.  I think you have unfairly thrown two vehicles (Jeep and Dodge / Ram) that have proven themselves in combat service to this Nation under the bus.  


Hill People Gear Coureurs des Bois (Brand Ambassador). Victoria faveat paratam. De Oppresso Liber.
 
New Post
8/9/2017 3:32 PM
 

I hope you're right about your Power Wagon!

The thing is that any given vehicle can either underperform or outperform the statistics, and there's really no way to know ahead of time if the specific vehicle is going to do that. Everybody knows you don't want a "friday afternoon" car, but there's no way to know if that's what you're looking at. So the best you can do is look at statistical services like CR as a guide to how a vehicle is going to last. By those measures (and *every* mechanic I've ever talked to - the owner of our local Jeep shop drives a Toyota for example), you really can't deny that Toyota is at the top of the heap when it comes to expected reliability. Doesn't mean others won't last as long or longer, but you're rolling the dice a lot more with other brands.

Anecdotally, my XJ has been extremely reliable, but a close friend had one (a year newer I think) that was plagued with electrical and mechanical problems to the point that he finally had to dump it. So is the story that XJs are really reliable, or a piece of crap?

Another factor is the degree to which you're ok with "upkeep" and what upkeep means. For example, for a long time the Nissan Titans had to have pretty expensive break work when they were 10k miles off the showroom floor. Was that acceptable upkeep? It was expected, so it wasn't exactly a reliability issue. Is front ball joints at 90k acceptable upkeep, or should the expectation be 240k (my XJ), or 310k (the landcruiser)? Total cost of ownership is perhaps the best metric because it boils down to dollars and cents. By that metric, the XJ beats out the Landcruiser by a pretty wide margin. Not because things like the radiator lasted longer on the XJ (it didn't), but because it was so much less expensive to replace that it more than made up for the extra 40k miles I got out of the Landcruiser's radiator before *it* had to be replaced.

Another thing that's hard to quantify is predictability. I've always said that the mechanical problems that are the worst are the ones that happen suddenly and unpredictably. Anything that a routine inspection or paying attention to your vehicle can identify, you can simply plan to fix ahead of time. By the unpredictability measure, the jeep failed me when the crank position sensor went out at around 150k. Pretty inexpensive fix, but it went from operational to "won't even start" overnight. The Landcruiser had a similar failure (different electrical component), but that ended up being a very time consuming and expensive fix. I've never seen any of the statistical services address those particular types of issues but they're the most important ones to me.

So, "reliability" isn't black and white at all and any brand and model might end up as being extremely reliable. But I still stand by my assertion that if reliability is most important to you, you buy a Toyota. Overall, that's the brand that has built an extremely good record and reputation over the course of decades. The other brands simply haven't.


We are fortunate in this matter that your conduct will be your marker and, thus, your reputation. The conduct of others on this forum has been, and will continue to be, their marker, and thus, their reputation. In the west, a person invests in one's reputation carefully. - 112Papa
 
New Post
8/9/2017 3:43 PM
 

Fair enough....and I will stand by my Power Wagon, and also Jeep (the solid axle seven slot ones).  I just feel you unfairly represented the Ram / Dodge and Jeep ones.  I would not be surprised if CR hasn't taken its share of kickbacks over the years....I don't trust hardly anybody anymore.  Incidentally, my grandfather was the Chief Mechanic of a Chevy dealer outside Pittsburgh for pretty much his entire adult life.....all he ever drove were Jeeps and Chryslers / Dodges.  The bosses at the shop gave him Hell over it....but he knew what worked and could be counted on!

Oh...and yes...I will be right about my Power Wagon!  That thing is a tank!

 

 


Hill People Gear Coureurs des Bois (Brand Ambassador). Victoria faveat paratam. De Oppresso Liber.
 
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8/10/2017 4:52 AM
 

I will add that the Taco has a pretty much cult-like following and I think they are probably pretty dang good.  I've seen some set up really nicely at the Overland Expo.  There is a lot that can be done with them, but would offer less space on a long trip.  

Jeep is supposedly bringing back its own pickup, and I think it is a quad cab.  How long the wait will be is a whole other story.


Hill People Gear Coureurs des Bois (Brand Ambassador). Victoria faveat paratam. De Oppresso Liber.
 
New Post
8/10/2017 8:17 AM
 
alpendrms wrote:

I will add that the Taco has a pretty much cult-like following and I think they are probably pretty dang good.

That's what Ken Cameron / 7p is using now for all of his training rigs. Test drove a used one yesterday for a friend who has been looking for one. I don't like the Camaro style seating position but I think I could learn to live with it pretty quickly. Nice vehicle. I'm not entirely sure it's big enough for 4 adults plus gear on a backcountry trip. 4 adults with backpacks, yes. 4 adults with a car camping amount of gear, iffy.


We are fortunate in this matter that your conduct will be your marker and, thus, your reputation. The conduct of others on this forum has been, and will continue to be, their marker, and thus, their reputation. In the west, a person invests in one's reputation carefully. - 112Papa
 
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8/10/2017 9:07 AM
 

Here is my 2 cents…

I have spent a lot of the last 15 years pushing real hard in the backcountry trapping, hunting, doing damage control, working dogs, and scouting out of a 4x4.

Probably approaching the 100k mile mark offroad and 4x4. I am pretty opinionated but can back it up with a mess of hard off-road miles, more than a few trucks tipped on their side, plenty of flats, a totaled truck, and plenty of near death experiences that involved poor vehicle decisions and gear choices.

Terrain is mountains, desert, high desert, lots of mud, bumper deep snow every so often, lots of narrow unkempt logging roads, and ranch roads. Nothing supper technical or rock climbing.

I started with a 97 Tacoma with a 3.4L. I gave it to a local kid and it’s still running with +350k miles probably a ¼ of which are off pavement. The neglect and abuse that truck has seen, and it still runs like…a Toyota.

Got a Gen 2 Tacoma (4.0L) it was a significant upgrade in power and plush-ness. It pulled a mule trailer much better with the added power but it was still not ideal safety wise if you going to pull a big trailer consistently. It didn’t handle as nimbly on narrow mountain two-tracks as the narrower Gen1. Finally rolled it down a hill and smashed it all to hell. The dog and I walked away without a scratch. It was still running when the wrecker dropped it off at the shop.

Then a Tundra 2007 (5.7L) and got back to work. It was a HUGE improvement in power, driver comfort, and carrying capacity. It was not nearly as nimble and responsive on the more technical terrain in the mountains and was much more “lumbering” in the deep mud and snow. However the bigger trucks just don’t beat the driver and dogs up as much and the smaller rigs when you are consistently running 150-250 mile traplines every other day. This was a big advantage to me. You can also carry more spare, redundancy, and comfort gear in the bigger trucks. Driver comfort and carrying capacity it has in spades!

Ran a Jeep Sahara 4.0L for a season. I could not have been happier to get rid of that rig. It was hot in the summer, cold in the winter, dangerous and unstable at high speed with a heavy load, poor fuel economy, and lousy gear carrying capacity. I realize it was an older underpowered CJ7’ish length model without all the new cool emanates. It did handle the narrow and more technical two-tracks amazingly well. The break over angles were amazing. The small size made it a dream to hide.

Currently I have a 2003 Tacoma DBL cab (3.4L) and I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE, this truck. It handles almost as well as the smaller jeep. Has plenty of power for the weight. Decent fuel economy. Reliable as an Estwing hammer. Carries two hunters, three dogs, and a pile of trapping and hunting gear with ease. Will easily haul two hunters, all their gear, and two boned out deer. Have tried that in a Jeep and it looked liked the Beverly Hillbillies meets Jeffry Dalmer.

The wife has a 2010 Tunra Crewmax (5.7L). Almost identical to the 2007 Excab but with a HUGE back seat and shorter 5’ bed. An offroad Cadillac.


Talk is cheap...lets compare fur checks.
 
New Post
8/10/2017 9:31 AM
 
Cont…

Toyota and good E-range tires are my recommendation. When the suspension goes put an OME on. Add all the lights you want and get to covering ground.





Talk is cheap...lets compare fur checks.
 
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8/10/2017 11:57 AM
 

Every anecdote is an exception to the aggregate, but I still trust the aggregate more then the anecdotes.

Certainly the aggregate opinion on toyotas is cluttered with a lot of hyperbole and myopia, but it is simply too true to ignore.

I like to look at farmers and other owners that typically have multiple years and models of high milage vehicles used in a fairly consistent manner. some farmers I worked for were jeep/dodge people, at least one 300k+ XJ and some 200K+ ZJs. All mechanically sound, but thats where it ended. All kinds of electrical problems, interiors falling apart, etc. Their fullsized 2500/3500 work pickups were in the shop with some regularity, but no consistent problems that wouldn't happen with other work pickups being used daily.

My wife's family and mine used to be ford people, from the 6-10 examples I've seen between the two the bad reputation of older fords is as deserved as the better reputation of newer fords. Most of the 90's vehicles barely made it past 100k before problems started cropping up and they were sold off, whether a bunch of money invested would have taken these to the higher numbers of other makes is a question, but surveying the used market I wouldn't put money on it. The examples bought since the early 2000s have been much better, but time will tell on milage.

An easy research step done at home: go on craigslist and start counting running cars for sale with over 300K miles. Mostly I see Jeeps (XJs specifically) and Toyotas (volvos and mercedes are easy to find as well, but outside the discussion). You will find all brands that meet this, but the Big Three tend to be outliers.

 
New Post
8/10/2017 12:21 PM
 
An excellent point on anecdotes and aggregates! I completely agree. I have been tempted to start a thread on "Context and Perspective" with an emphasis on human bias...but I am afraid it will come off as a rant.

That is a neat idea about checking Craigslist (or Cars.com) for running vehicles or 300k miles.

Talk is cheap...lets compare fur checks.
 
New Post
8/10/2017 3:35 PM
 

My most recent car (a honda with 190K) is the first car I have ever owned with fewer then 200K, so I have a pretty high tolerence for high milage cars compared to most folks. When I was shopping for my 4runner I almost bought one that had over 300k, it was a dealership's runaround car and looked pretty well maintained considering and was probably cleaner then the one I ended up buying.

 

My other advice that served me well is whenever possible, rent cars for long trips. There are several cars I was pretty excited about at 50 miles that I had completely written off at 2-300 miles. Only works for newer cars, and its hard to get one specific vehicle but don't be afraid to ask the renter what they have sitting on the lot.

 
New Post
8/15/2017 2:28 PM
 
Have been perusing CL looking at vehicles myself. There are many Toyotas out there in the 200k+ range, but an awful lot of Ford and Chevy trucks -- especially 3/4 and 1 ton both diesel and gas in that category. Less Dodge, but less are sold. Toyotas have a great rep, but some of the luster has come off lately despite Consumer Reports. Don't forget the issues with frames rusting a while back. That is not inconsequential. Most new stuff is pretty good. Cars are simply lasting longer across the board. 100k used to be time for parting out for many vehicles. Now that is just the first major service.

Compared to trucks and other SUVs, Jeep Wranglers suffer not only from a space deficiency but also a payload one as well. However, they are an awful lot of fun on the trail and mine has been trouble free for 50,000 miles. I think a mid-sized truck is more versatile though, especially as people are added. If I didn't need to tow, I'd look hard at the Chevy Colorado ZR2 for an all around outdoor vehicle. And if you're not towing a lot of weight or something really big, the diesel would do a fair amount of towing at that. Lots of good choices out there.
 
New Post
8/16/2017 8:20 AM
 

This is something I've been musing about myself. When you talk about 200k plus miles, you're talking about a 10 year or more time horizon. Does looking at what was made well 10 or more years ago really have a lot of bearing on what is being made well today? Some, but it's not a lot to go on. You'd basically have to limit yourself to models that are significantly unchanged from 10 years ago and I'm not sure there really are any. I think that actually lends more emphasis to the brand reputation because it's about all you have to go on.


We are fortunate in this matter that your conduct will be your marker and, thus, your reputation. The conduct of others on this forum has been, and will continue to be, their marker, and thus, their reputation. In the west, a person invests in one's reputation carefully. - 112Papa
 
New Post
8/16/2017 10:07 AM
 
I think it actually indicates that as of a certain point, most vehicles have dramatically improved in longevity. It may have used to have been Toyota (note the 80s era 22R powered small trucks that have 300k plus and allow you to service without opening the hood as you reach in through the rusted out side.) ;) Comparatively an 80's era Chevy S-10 was a complete pile of crap. Ask me how I know.

And when it comes to trucks, many of those are actually pretty recent ones that did a lot of highway driving for whatever reason. Have been amazed at how quickly people can put on miles. I think if you're buying used, it is much more important to evaluate how the vehicle has been maintained than to simply focus on brand.

Here is a Toyota with pretty high miles. Do we focus on the miles or the recall work?
https://westslope.craigslist.org/cto/d/2006-toyota-tacoma-4wd-sr5/6266731927.html
 
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